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Aqueduct shinecharges#1999

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osse101 merged 5 commits intovg-json-data:masterfrom
blkerby:stutter-shinecharges-4
Apr 25, 2025
Merged

Aqueduct shinecharges#1999
osse101 merged 5 commits intovg-json-data:masterfrom
blkerby:stutter-shinecharges-4

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@blkerby blkerby commented Apr 3, 2025

This refines the water shinecharge strats entering from the bottom-left door of Aqueduct. This time I took a closer look at how the runway length affects the amount of frames remaining with "Leave Shinecharged" strats. It turned out to make a fairly big difference. Making 5 strats for the various runway lengths might seem like a bit of overkill, but there are applications for each case; maybe someday we'll be able to reference the runway length in the requires so that they wouldn't have to all be separate strats. Once this PR is merged, I plan to go back and apply the same refinement to leaveShinecharged variants in the other rooms (e.g. Precious Room, West Sand Hall Tunnel, Oasis).

Example applications:
1 tile, Screw Attack Room: https://videos.maprando.com/video/5923
2 tiles, Waterway: https://videos.maprando.com/video/5922
3 tiles, Colosseum: https://videos.maprando.com/video/5925
4 tiles, Below Spazer: https://videos.maprando.com/video/5924
5 tiles, Moat: https://videos.maprando.com/video/5927

@blkerby blkerby added the Area:Maridia Stuff in Maridia label Apr 3, 2025
Comment thread region/brinstar/pink/Waterway Energy Tank Room.json Outdated
Comment thread region/maridia/inner-pink/Aqueduct.json Outdated
Comment thread region/maridia/inner-pink/Aqueduct.json Outdated
{"types": ["missiles", "powerbomb"], "requires": ["never"]}
],
"note": [
"With only a runway of 4 tiles (open end) in the other room,",
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I tried 4 and 5 tiles for a while and couldn't get close to leaving with frames with either.
I was able to leave with ~15 frames using the moonwalk trick instead of jumping (moonwalk then switch to running forward on the next frame).

These strats don't scale down since you lose so many frames to a suboptimal input, so they need stronger requirements.

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Yeah, I think it makes sense to add "canInsaneJump" to all of these.

Comment thread region/maridia/inner-pink/Aqueduct.json Outdated
"canInsaneJump",
"canBeVeryPatient",
"canShinechargeMovementTricky",
{"shineChargeFrames": 175}
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You can get about 20 frames with the moonwalk trick, and at these requirements its probably the better approach

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Interesting, looking into the moonwalk trick, then will update the requirements & notes

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@blkerby blkerby Apr 14, 2025

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With a better stutter, I was able to get 30 shinecharge frames remaining: https://videos.maprando.com/video/6037. This is using a new, easier setup for the stutter which I found by accident (doing an arm pump by pressing up). It eliminates the need for the complicated subpixel normalization (to $3FFF), instead just using subpixels of $7FFF which can be obtained with the standard normalization, by backing into the corner below the door frame, then jump and mid-air turnaround (though that doesn't work here in Blue Boulder Room, because of the water). The simplified setup gives you the shinecharge a little further from the door but could be worth it for reducing the hassle.

Aside from the large impact on the 1-tile runway setup, the moonwalk tech also helps some with the 2-tile and 3-tile setups, so I updated those as well. The shinecharge frames are not really too optimized (e.g. put it in as 20 frames remaining for the 1-tile runway, though >30 is possible); I didn't want to push it too far since these strats are already very difficult. Could always be tightened later though.

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  • Moonwalk boomerang does need to be a new tech, at some point. At extreme I'd imagine.
  • Getting the perfect room entry took many many tries, focusing on the 1 tile runway. But then leaving the room still takes multiple precise inputs (stopping around the right place, the crouch-stand-turnaround spin, the second jump or moonwalk trick)
  • I timed the strats without grinding much, and they seem like they are like 20frames slower if you aren't moving perfectly.

Comment thread region/maridia/inner-pink/Aqueduct.json Outdated
Comment on lines +1132 to +1135
{"shineChargeFrames": 150},
{"or": [
"canBeVeryPatient",
{"shineChargeFrames": 10}
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At extreme it feels to me like

  • you can leave with 10 frames if you moonwalk boomerang
  • otherwise you can't reach the door with frames (<5)

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I'm interpreting this as increasing {"shineChargeFrames": 10} to {"shineChargeFrames": 15} in the or? Then without canBeVeryPatient, the logic will say it uses 165 frames, meaning 170 with the Extreme lenience.

I find the moonwalk boomerang harder to execute compared to getting a perfect stutter, but it makes sense that this is going to vary by player; with more practice probably I could get more comfortable with it.

Comment thread region/maridia/inner-pink/Aqueduct.json Outdated
"canPreciseStutterWaterShineCharge",
"canShinechargeMovementTricky",
"canInsaneJump",
{"shineChargeFrames": 130}
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150 at extreme

"canPreciseStutterWaterShineCharge",
"canShinechargeMovementTricky",
"canInsaneJump",
{"shineChargeFrames": 145},
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160 at extreme

Comment thread region/maridia/inner-pink/Aqueduct.json Outdated
"canPreciseStutterWaterShineCharge",
"canShinechargeMovementTricky",
"canInsaneJump",
{"shineChargeFrames": 140}
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155 at extreme

@osse101 osse101 merged commit 698b5e9 into vg-json-data:master Apr 25, 2025
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@blkerby blkerby deleted the stutter-shinecharges-4 branch February 15, 2026 00:08
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2 participants