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Add mid-air morph damage boost option to escape beta PBs#2070

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osse101 merged 3 commits intovg-json-data:masterfrom
blkerby:beta-pb-morph-damage-boost
Jun 3, 2025
Merged

Add mid-air morph damage boost option to escape beta PBs#2070
osse101 merged 3 commits intovg-json-data:masterfrom
blkerby:beta-pb-morph-damage-boost

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@blkerby blkerby commented May 26, 2025

This is an easier option (if Morph is available) so seems good to include in logic.

Video by Sam: https://videos.maprando.com/video/5804

@blkerby blkerby added the Area:Brinstar Stuff in Brinstar label May 26, 2025
osse101
osse101 previously approved these changes May 29, 2025
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Looking at this, I'm thinking the canHorizontalDamageBoost is unreasonable. Its more intuitive than there being a safe spot, but I don't think you can reliably escape until you discover the edge of the thorn and probably find the safe spot.
It does still function as an alternate tech with some damage, compared to the trickyJump.

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blkerby commented May 30, 2025

Yeah, boosting horizontally is not really helpful so the "canHorizontalDamageBoost" requirement seems misleading. I found this method works to get a neutral boost without Morph: https://videos.maprando.com/video/6497. This is spin jumping, pressing against one of the walls, then tapping the opposite direction to land on top of the thorn. The neutral knockback then places Samus conveniently on the opposite side of the pit. I think it's unintuitive enough that "canTrickyJump" is justified, because the tendency will be to not understand where the thorn is and to hold forward when touching it, knocking Samus back down. Neutral boost without Morph still seems like a viable alternative to the safe spot strat though it's not necessarily easier. The i-frames it gives can also help with avoiding a Hopper hit in case one was accidentally left alive.

"canNeutralDamageBoost",
{"or": [
"canMidAirMorph",
"canTrickyJump"
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With trickyjump, you would land on the safe spot using #21

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Right, with this PR the morphless damage boost option doesn't add anything logically since it is technically superseded by the safe spot strat; having it as an option just helps document that it's a possible thing to do. This is assuming VH is the right place for both the morphless damage boost and safe spot strats?

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We typically havent been including strats that are strictly harder or have more requirements than another strat (This seems to be a similar difficulty but has more requirements). Generally, when we add strats like that, we will try to combine them together, so that we can mention them both in the same note - which could help provide an alternative if someone is struggling with a strat. Is there a good way to combine the morphless tricky jump variant with the safe spot jump?

"canMidAirMorph",
"canNeutralDamageBoost"
]},
"canHorizontalDamageBoost"
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To me, it feels a lot easier to just land on the safe ledge than get the horizontal boost

Edit: Oh, guess I never submitted this comment, but it was already addressed anyway

"canNeutralDamageBoost",
{"or": [
"canMidAirMorph",
"canTrickyJump"
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We typically havent been including strats that are strictly harder or have more requirements than another strat (This seems to be a similar difficulty but has more requirements). Generally, when we add strats like that, we will try to combine them together, so that we can mention them both in the same note - which could help provide an alternative if someone is struggling with a strat. Is there a good way to combine the morphless tricky jump variant with the safe spot jump?

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blkerby commented May 30, 2025

Just did some more testing and found that for the safe spot strat, if you're aligned with the wall you need to tap forward for between 1 and 4 frames. For the neutral damage boost strat, you have about a 25-frame window to press away from the wall, you have to press for at least 3 frames in order for it to not be a stationary turnaround, but aside from that you can hold as long as you like as long as you release before touching the thorn; the size of that window depends on when you turned but in the worst case you can still hold anywhere between 3 and 23 frames, so it's very lenient.

Given the amount of lenience here, I think the morphless neutral damage boost could just require a canCarefulJump rather than canTrickyJump. Then both the morph and morphless versions would be in Hard (based on the canNeutralDamageBoost requirement), while the safe spot strat would be in Very Hard. The morphless damage boost may be a bit tricky of a knowledge check for Hard but it only applies as a wall jump avoid so I'm thinking it's probably ok?

@osse101 osse101 merged commit c530272 into vg-json-data:master Jun 3, 2025
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@blkerby blkerby deleted the beta-pb-morph-damage-boost branch February 15, 2026 00:08
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3 participants